Forum - Banjo Ben Clark

Precious Memories key of D

Hey!! I’m back… :grimacing:
Last Sunday got into another musical situation… in church… in front of people…only mandolin & guitar. Was a last minute thing. This is my 1st time actually playing the song, but unlike last time, was already familiar with it - I’d heard it before. + the singer sang me a few bars on the side just before we played it, & I thought I had it - great! Then, Ut Oh, todays challenge is: when the guitar guy says key of D, and you’re ready, but then he capoes at 2 and plays out of C or something like that (I dont really know) & trying to follow the chords!! It’s kind of like capoing and/or transposing the NNS. :confounded: Yes I’ve heard the song before, the melody is familiar, but unlike @Dragonslayer, I dont exactly get chord progressions quickly… the struggle was real lol! Anyway a few things - tried to clean it up and not play over the vocals (one of @Fiddle_wood 's suggestions, thank you!) And tried to do chopping (vs strumming) as @Mark_Rocka & I were saying how we’re just that tad bit behind when you dont know the song. Seems chops hide it better, but only when you actually play the correct chord :thinking:!! Anybody have suggestions on following guitars that capo then play outta different positions on songs you’re not sure about? Attached is audio from that day (sorry its low - cell phone) with slideshow (Winter in the South pics). Any & all comments or advice are welcome! Thanx for listening :blush:!

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YES!
Onna my very favorite songs! As I write this now, your melodic lead is emerging and it’s spot on. I really like the guy’s voice singing the song too.

If you ever wanna do a collab on this one, just lemme know. It’s one of the first songs I ever learned! (Believe it or not, my favorite instrument to play this on is my piano…)

Fine piece of work! You have every right to be proud of this.
Billy Shaw

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Simone…excellent job on the solo.

If the guitar capos on 2, and is shaping the root chord like a C, then he is actually playing in D.

Going with chunking the chords was a great idea, and you still sounded right in key with the solo. So, were you playing in D?

Just ask the guitar player what the actual key is with the capo added, and play in that key. You’ll be fine.

Great job!

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I think she means how do you follow the chord progression of the song based on the guitar player’s hands if you aren’t familiar with it. For instance, you know you are playing in D and you know the guitar chord shapes, but when they capo and play out of C your brain wants to make C, F, and G positions which is what the guitar player is doing, but on the mandolin without a capo you need to be playing D, G and A.

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Excellent job on the break! Nice tremolo, and I like the blue note in the tag!

This situation is exactly why I play by number or position and not by note names. Trying to transpose capoed guitar chords, at speed, while playing is a headache…

Recognising where a progression will go by ear/position is far quicker and easier for me almost every time unless the progression involves many chords or they change too quick to do unless memorised. .

I thought it was outstanding!

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Love it! @Simone

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Simone, to just pull that off the hat, you have to be really music knowledgeable with several ideas! Very cool interlude! Nicely fits into the song.

I kind of attempted to copy to play that piece in guitar… https://banjoben-discourse-upload.s3.dualstack.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/original/2X/f/f70466fd190fa697a068713496e1eab6af49a6c9.m4a . I know I gotto to listen to more to fully get that.

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Thank you @BillyD!!
You enjoyed it enuff to suggest a collab! Wow!
What key would you be singing it in?
I’ll let the singer know you liked his voice cuz after we were done, he said that key was probably too low for him…

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Thank you @Treblemaker!!
Yes, I was playing in D, & the guitar did tell me we were gonna be in D. I was just expecting him to actually play D G A outright, never knew this capo at what’s usually an A (2) could be turned into a D like that! Totally threw me off! (That’s what I get for expecting lol!)

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Thank you @Michael_Mark!!
You totally clarified what I was trying to say. Exactly!! Add in guitar capo at 2 is usually transposed A D E for mandolins, but he’s using C F G positions, & I’m playing D G A. Enter brain meltdown… Now I’m wondering what other guitar capo tricks are out there waiting, lurking… :grin:

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Thank you @Fiddle_wood!!

Indeed! By # do you mean NNS? & what did you mean by position? Chord shapes? (No worry on the note names, I only know a few…) I was lucky the song was slow, if it was at bluegrass or fiddle tune speed I’d have been very lost trying to transpose capoed guitar chords, & picking the break! As for the blue note, I got that idea from Ben’s various arrangements & suddenly thought “:bulb:” hey… I can put that here :grin:!

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Thank you @Archie!!! :grin:

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Depends on the instrument, but yes, generally, for playing a chord progression I think in numbers and how they correspond with position of the notes of the scale of the key, or sometimes I think in the chord shapes.

for playing breaks I think the same way except it is in the scale of the chord being played at the moment. and I am more shape oriented.

I wouldn’t say I’m really up on all the ins & outs of the NNS, but I have a sort of hillbilly/simplified way of understanding it.

hope this makes sense.

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Thank you @jmonickaraj1!!
I don’t really have of alot of musical knowledge, did band 2 years for flute/piccolo in jr high school. I listen to music a lot. Like, (lol!), I’d rather have music on than the TV, anyday! You sounded great on your guitar version,:+1:t2:!!

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Hopeful to eventually work up to that level of skill!! Nice lofty goal to shoot for :grin:! As for NNS I’m alright on 1 4 5, not so good on 2 3 6!

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2 & 6 can be tricky 'cause you have to figure out if they are major or minor.
Hint: if they come near the end of the progression heading toward the 5 they are probably major (or 7th)

3 will usually be either flatted (modern sounding) or a 7th (old home place)

As you play more it will get easier to recognise this stuff by ear quicker.

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Thanks Simone! Keep it coming then, I can learn/steal ideas from your performances! :wink: Nice harmony!! Good thing in your church you guys sing/play songs that I’m familiar with. I too agree with F_W, the singer has great voice!

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Thanx for that! I’ve got this cheat chart in my phone & was wondering why for some songs we do in G, like ‘don’t worry about me’ (Paul Williams), we go to the A (not on chart), but for others we do the Am (cant think of a particular song at the moment) (which is on the chart).

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Sounds great, you did very well!
For following a capoed guitar it’s best if you play guitar and capo frequently, otherwise it’s easy to get lost (actually it’s easy to get lost anyway). Just be aware that a guitarist can play out of any position with a capo, so it might be best to follow the sounds not the look in some cases

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Well, you did outstanding! I love love love that solo, just absolutely perfect for what the song and situation calls for. I’ve been in your shoes before, had a bit of panic, crashed and burned, and got better. Numbers are helpful here. Rather than think D, G, A, think 1, 4, 5. That way, no matter what the key is, you know the chords. It will be tricky watching him play the chord shapes on the guitar, but you can get used to that and transpose faster and faster in your head. You’re gonna be just fine, y’all sounded great!

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