See if this helps, @johnbmcglade. You picked one of the older ones and I’ve changed the count-in since making that one:
Getting started with rhythm tracks
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Hi Ben, that was very generous to make that little video for me. That makes it much more understandable. I have to start using my ears first and the fingering later.
Thanks very much and all the best,
John
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Hi Mark, thanks for your very thorough answer. I can see that trying to wing it, without counting is a mistake. I get your point and will spend some time, before I start playing to figure out the timing. I had been using just the .pdf file. Now I’ve tried the .tef a few times and I can, at least, see where I’m going wrong. This is advice that I’m going to follow.
Thanks again,
John
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Hi Woodshed,
It makes perfect sense and is something that I know that I need to work on. I wan’t hearing the bass notes before, or at least, wasn’t thing about them.
I get blown away by how generous everyone on Banjo Ben’s is with their time and advice.
Thanks again,
John
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Hey John. Exactly what @MarkRocka and @BanjoBen and @Woodshed said.
I think too, that another important aspect of being a musician, is the ability to actually play with another musician. This is vitally important. Learning to play with another musician I think is one of the perhaps hidden aspects of Banjo Bens lessons. The lessons accomplish at least two very important things: 1) You learn how to Play the song 2) You learn how to “Perform” the song with another musician, in this case, using the back-up track at a steady tempo. You’re off to a great start!
Lastly, I think that most musicians would agree, that in order to “Perform” a tune well with other musicians, we must develop the ability not only to “play”, but to listen to the rest of the band (or back-up track) while we are playing our instrument and adjust as necessary for the better overall sound. This does force us to multi-task! Keep up the great work and please let us know how you are progressing. I must warn you though. The more you learn, the more fun playing your instrument becomes! 
HAPPY PICKING!!
Hi Neil,
How do you go about memorizing a song? Do you think about the string progression like 3251 3251 or do you memorize the actual notes ie. GBDD, or just use muscle memory and the melody in your head?
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I memorize either a “statement” , four notes, or a measure at a time, depending on phrasing, by getting the melody in my head and then by playing it (learning note by note) until comfortable and repeatable without looking/ play-along.
then I go to the next statement/measure and repeat
Then put the two together and repeat until comfortable and repeatable without looking/ play-along. Speaking for myself…Forcing myself to memorize first and learn to execute later has at least tripled my learning & memorization skills/speed…I’ve found that having it down cold in my brain is essential for me to progress with any noticeable speed.
Generally I do this successively with each statement/measure until the entire piece is learned.
When I started out some ten years ago I spent a lot of time learning roll patterns. This wasn’t so much about learning how to memorize and play tunes. It was more about learning the mechanics of playing the banjo. I didn’t think in terms of 3251 I just looked at the pattern of strings and just picked them over and over until it became second nature.
When you first climbed on a bike or sat behind the wheel of a car you had to learn the mechanics of operating these vehicles before you became competent enough to operate them. Making the journey came much later when you acquired certain skills.
Memorizing a song comes from listening. You listen then you hum or sing along. Once you have the sound in you head you try to replicate the melody by picking out the notes on the strings. @BanjoBen 's Build-a-Break lessons guide you through this process. Then it’s all down to practice.
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Hello John. Great question and it gives me pause to think about it. To be honest, when I’m sitting around a campfire or jamming with other folks in the living room, I pretty much have programmed rolls and licks that I can play around a melody in my head that I pick out, with the rolls around the melody. For example, I rarely play the same version of “I’ll Fly Away” twice. In contrast, learning someone’s Tab, like Banjo Ben’s for example, I’ll learn note for note exactly to learn what’s going on in Banjo Ben’s Head. Since he is a professional, I have to accept that he knows what he’s doing. After I memorize his Tab and get comfortable with it, I’ll invariably start playing it MY way with small modifications. However, I must say, that B.Ben’s Tabs are what you might call “Premium”. They are honestly, the best I’ve seen on the Web as far as accuracy, clarity, economic finger movement and tasteful arrangements. But as far as memorizing, I learn Tabs by setting up short 3-4 measure ‘loops’ and the memorization comes with learning. You’ll get different opinions for different folks I suppose, but you’ll find out what works best for you.
Tonight we recorded Meli and myself playing June Apple. I’ll post, but you can see from the video, I’m reading a lot of the Tab while I’m playing, but most of the difficult passages you can see I have memorized. Have fun picking. It’s a blast!!
Thanks, this sounds like good advice. I have been playing the whole song repeatedly and of course keep getting tripped up at the same place.
Hi Archie, yes it’s the mechanics that’s killing me. I’m probably not listening enough. I just want to get right in and start playing.
I have a hard time translating what’s playing in my head into my fingers. I can hear when it’s wrong, I just can envision what is right. I’ll try listening more and it will hopefully get better.
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patience…it all takes time. Good news…you’re normal.
Hi Neil, I’m more at the stage where I’m struggling with the tab and improv seems way down the road. I sure sounds like more fun. I’ll look out for your June Apple post. Thanks for your help.
John
Fiddle wood nailed it. It does all take time. Maybe take Banjo Ben’s demo recording way slowed…down. Then try to copy his picking and timing note for note. Maybe only a measure at a time.
Hi John, That is totally understandable and what you have to realize is we all go through that phase of impatience and frustration at our seemingly lack of progress. But if your putting in the time to study and practice then trust me you are making progress even although it may not seem like you are.
You have to remember you are learning a new skill that requires you to multitask. That is a lot of information for your brain to process.
There is so much information to absorb. It takes Patience, Perseverance and Practice, lots of it to learn to play banjo.
So here’s my advice. Work your way through Ben’s Beginner Learning Track. Don’t waste time measuring your skill level with how others are doing,
For now focus ALL your energy on learning the roll patterns in Ben’s Banjo Roll Studies and The Banjo Fret Hand Techniques. These are the key fundamental skills you will need to move forward. If you follow this learning track you will be learning to play some simple tunes as you go. Making progress at your speed and skill level.
Don’t rush through this section take your time and absorb what Ben is teaching you. If you find a task is too difficult, Slow down, break things down to a manageable level. One measure, half a measure or even one note at a time. I still do this when I am struggling.
As for learning the mechanics if it’s killing you Slooooow Down. The best way to practice roll patterns is with a metronome or as I much prefer TablEdit using .tef files. Once you have a grasp of playing rolls practice them whilst watching TV. By doing this you are allowing the brain to begin the process of multitasking. Eventually the brain will do this on auto pilot leaving you to focus on the fretting hand.
Remember the key to progress is listening. Listening to the melody, to yourself and to others in a band.
Now stop fretting and go have some fun.
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Hi Archie, thanks again. I have already started following your advice and have slowed way down and surprisingly having a lot more fun. Now that I have been working on these rolls repeatedly, I find that after playing steady for 5 or so minutes, I start missing notes. It’s either I’m losing concentration or my fingers are just getting fatigued. Can tired fingers affect your playing?
Thanks,
John
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I find the opposite. After five minutes I stop missing notes, and I finally speed up
Hi John, Both, lack of concentration and tired fingers at this stage are common so you will find you do miss strings, and your picks will also get caught in the strings.
Really after five minutes and 9 days practice you are just beginning to warm up, learn to relax and breathe normally and don’t pick too hard . Give your body and your brain a chance to adapt. The more you practice the better you become so it’s a win, win situation.
Your end goal is not to think what roll pattern to play. Overtime you learn to adapt and play any roll pattern, auto pilot will kick in and you stop thinking about the roll completely as your brain takes over.
Do you watch TV when practicing rolls?
If not now is the time to start. With your attention focused on a movie or a ball game you will find you picking hand can go on picking rolls for long periods without you becoming bored. You are also preparing your brain (dividing your thoughts) to focus on your fretting hand whilst the picking hand does it part.
Remember the three P’s Patience, Perseverance and Practice. Lots and lots of it.
This works for me too. I do this often; or a radio mystery or something with a headset on with a banjo mute in place. When I’m in this zone, I can practice a piece slowly and loop the so-called “speed-bumps” that give me difficulty, always demanding perfect even picking and low finger-action from my picking hand. Like magic, you’ll build hand strength, endurance, accuracy, memorization etc… I also feel that stretching my picking hand and hand relaxation exercises is important at least to me. This you might consider if you feel your picking hand getting tense or slow-down a bit. I takes awhile, but with practice & coordination, you’re hand will get more relaxed. While picking speed is important for up-tempo songs, it is dangerous to try to get there too fast and as a result, I only spend about 2% of my practice time on this, never sacrificing evenness of picking or accuracy.
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