Forum - Banjo Ben Clark

Discuss the lesson: Intro to Music Theory Part 8- Music Keys

Yeah, I was thinking it didn’t look quite right with only two, but I’m not a math person at all :joy:

Archie that sounded slightly Chinese

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Good though. I’d live to try it out.

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Uhhh, this isn’t right at all…

First off, a chord is a set of notes (combined to be played simultaneously or one after the other as in an arpeggio) which includes what is commonly known as a triad (root, third and fifth). Chords or “harmonies” can be inferred with two notes (as if in the key of C major and playing an “F” and an “A” note with the F in the root which leans the listener toward the sound of the IV chord as long as the preceding chord is not something like a ii chord (D, F, A). Not all note combinations can be called a “chord” per se. For example, if you play the following chords on the piano adjacent to each other “C, C#, D, D#” that is a tone cluster and not a chord as thought of in a basic song writing. Such a chord might be used in modern classical music theory (and is by many composers), but is not something you would normally use during a bluegrass tune.

Chords can be extended however with various notes of the scale to which the origin of the chord belongs. For example, a C6 chord (C major 6) includes the 1, 3, 5 of the C major scale with the added 6 degree of the scale (C, E, G, A). Such a chord with the C in the root will have a major tonality with the A adding a relaxed color to it. However, the same notes with the A in the root position spells an Am7 ( A minor 7) chord (A, C, E, G) and has a completely different sound. In addition, some chords can have so many added notes that the chord can begin to lean toward sounding like a tone cluster like a G13 (G, B, D, F, A, C, E) which is essentially an entire G mixolydian scale played simultaneously. Of course, most folks will leave out the 9th (A) and the 11th (C ) from that chord and guitarists often favor also leaving out the 5th (D).

As far as the number of possible chords, that is only limited by your imagination. For example, If I were going to write a dominate chord (V) in the key of C major, I might spell such a chord G, B, D. Of course that is the most basic sound of such a chord and a stronger dominate chord might be spelled, G, B, D, F. And if I wanted to add color, I might spell it:
G, B, D, F, A (G9) or G, B, D, F, E (G13) or G, B, D, F, A# (G7#9) or G, B, D, F, Ab (G7b9) or G, B, D#, F, Ab (G7#5b9) or any number of interesting colors added to the standard dominant 7th chord sound. And that is only in root position as all of these chords could be inverted with any of the chord tones in the root or on top depending on how you would like to voice it.

To sum up, I don’t think most musicians would consider all the notes of the scale played at once as a “chord”, but rather as a note or tone cluster. A chord, in the modern sense of the word, is a harmony (often 3 or more notes but can be inferred by 2 notes) that can be defined as having a root, or a definable tonal center. A tone cluster does not really fit this description.

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One other point to be made.

There are many different definitions of “music”. One such definition is painted with an extremely broad brush: Music = Organized sound. Even though such a definition can easily be argued, I doubt that many folks would consider the sound of cars purposely crashed into a brick wall to be music (unless those cars were Fiats :laughing: ). With such a broad brush, a tone cluster could indeed be considered a chord (C13#4#5b9#9 ???), but such a chord would have no particular use in most popular styles of music.

Finally, let me make one more point. My wife and son have told me that I have tendency to speak definitively, as if there can be no other reasonable answer. PLEASE take anything/everything I say with a grain of salt. Just a few decades back, it was unreasonable to think that everyone would walk around with a battery powered computer in their pocket 100s of times more powerful than the computer that first took men to the moon. And if you had told me back in 1980 that I would be paying more than a $1 for a tiny bottle of plain water someday, I would have called you crazy (ever bought a bottle of water in a movie theater??). So if you have other thoughts on my babbling, please feel free to share.

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I think you’re right on all all accounts, and this comment

Is absolutely hilarious, I literally laughed out loud! :joy::joy::joy::joy:

I speak from experience about the Fiats. The first car I drove was a 1963 Fiat 1100D.

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Well that’s cool! Here’s the first car I drove. 64 Plymouth Barracuda. 273 V8 - pushbutton transmission. Anyone else want to join in.

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Image result for premier padmini picture

Fiat was under the name “Premier Padmini” in India. One of my uncles had it several years ago, bunch of my class mates also had it (their parents car), when car was a rare commodity in India.

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My first car was a Fiat X1/9. I was bummed when the guy I sold it to ran it into a wall :frowning:

You should have kept it… I’m sure there will be someone willing to pay a lot more as it is rare now!

Wow! I learned to drive that car when I was 10. Was yours a 4 speed on the column with reverse to the back and down? Our Fiat died sitting in our back yard from rust and disuse. I spent a summer trying to revive it when I was 23 years old, but failed (ran out of time and still needed a timing chain). Still, it brings back fond memories.

Jack, that fastback is sweet. I had a 65 Corvair that also had an unusual auto trans, a small 2 speed lever on the dashboard.

Mike, I remember the X1/9 and fell in love (inspite of being a previous Fiat owner). They were a cool, if tiny, car.

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@DrGuitar1, yep that was a 4-speed on the column! Seems like the only difference is the steering wheel placement and in our case it was always placed on the “right” side of the vehicle!! I’m not sure I ever drove fiat, maybe once or twice, but I have driven a very similar type of car ( a little bit bulky one though) which was called Ambassador. But yes Fiat brings back lot of good memories from my college days as 3 in our small class had this fiat!

John, I like the background. What do you is the most interesting thing about being Indian?

Hi Jack, I never really thought about that. Let me see. In India, we have one of the oldest civilizations - Indus valley civilization from 3300 BC to 1300 BC. We have several languages, religion, culture, habits etc. The language I speak Tamil is probably the oldest language in the whole wide world! In Tamil, there is a lot of literature. This Tamil state I’m from in India is a very peace loving state, very hospitable people, very firm in our values. In the modern day, we are not the worst even if we are not the best in the world in terms of technology. :slight_smile: I think we are keeping the right balance!

Thank for sharing John. I always love to hear people’s story’s.

:slight_smile:

Well done! That’s the best explanation I’ve seen of key signatures.

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Conclusion: The brain created music and therefore created its own problems.

I’ll never understand music theory. I can’t believe this is just the introduction…

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Hey Trev! Welcome to the board. You’ll get it. It’s really just all about how 1 note relates to other notes. That’s theory in a nutshell. Most musicians keep learning theory their whole lives. I remember a friend of Paul Buskirk (who was literally in the music industry his entire life) telling me that Paul was still figuring out new theory in his last stages of his life.

Try working with the circle of 5ths to see if that helps. Note that clockwise, it’s the circle of 5ths, but counter-clockwise, it’s the circle of 4ths. So that one tool can show you the 1 - 4 - 5 of any key signature at a simple glance.

Keep coming back and asking questions. This is a great place to learn.

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